奥巴马罗姆尼辩论会：2012美国总统大选首场电视辩论视频及文(11)

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MR. LEHRER: We'll talk about — specifically about health care in a moment, but what is — do you support the voucher system, Governor?

MR. ROMNEY: What I support is no change for current retirees and near-retirees to Medicare and the president supports taking $716 billion out of that program.

MR. LEHRER: What about the vouchers?

MR. ROMNEY: So that's — that's number one.

MR. LEHRER: OK. All right.

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They'll have at least two plans.

And by the way, if the government can be as efficient as the private sector and offer premiums that are as low as the private sector, people will be happy to get traditional Medicare, or they'll be able to get a private plan. I know my own view is I'd rather have a private plan. I — I'd just as soon not have the government telling me what kind of health care I get. I'd rather be able to have an insurance company. If I don't like them, I can get rid of them and find a different insurance company. But people will make their own choice.

The other thing we have to do to save Medicare, we have to have the benefits high for those that are low-income, but for higher-income people, we're going to have to lower some of the benefits. We have to make sure this program is there for the long term. That's the plan that I've put forward.

And by the way, the idea came not even from Paul Ryan or — or Senator Wyden, who's a co-author of the bill with — with Paul Ryan in the Senate, but also it came from Bill Clinton's — Bill Clinton's chief of staff. This is an idea that's been around a long time, which is saying, hey, let's see if we can't get competition into the Medicare world so that people can get the choice of different plans at lower cost, better quality. I believe in competition.

PRESIDENT OBAMA: Jim, if I — if I can just respond very quickly, first of all, every study has shown that Medicare has lower administrative cost than private insurance does, which is why seniors are generally pretty happy with it. And private insurers have to make a profit. Nothing wrong with that; that's what they do. And so you've got higher administrative costs, plus profit on top of that, and if you are going to save any money through what Governor Romney's proposing, what has to happen is is that the money has to come from somewhere.

And when you move to a voucher system, you are putting seniors at the mercy of those insurance companies. And over time, if traditional Medicare has decayed or fallen apart, then they're stuck. And this is the reason why AARP has said that your plan would weaken Medicare substantially, and that's why they were supportive of the approach that we took.

One last point I want to make. We do have to lower the cost of health care. Not just in Medicare and —

MR. LEHRER: We'll talk about that in a minute.

PRESIDENT OBAMA: — but — but overall.

MR. LEHRER: Go. OK.

PRESIDENT OBAMA: And so —

MR. ROMNEY: That's — that's a big topic. Could we — could we stay on Medicare?

PRESIDENT OBAMA: Is that a — is that a separate topic? I'm sorry.

MR. LEHRER: Yeah, we're going to — yeah. I want to get to it, but all I want to do is very quickly —

MR. ROMNEY: Let's get back to Medicare.

MR. LEHRER: — before we leave the economy —

MR. ROMNEY: Let's get back to Medicare.

MR. LEHRER: No, no, no, no —

MR. ROMNEY: The president said that the government can provide the service at lower —

MR. LEHRER: No.

MR. ROMNEY: — cost and without a profit.

MR. LEHRER: All right.

MR. ROMNEY: If that's the case, then it will always be the best product that people can purchase. But my experience —

MR. LEHRER: Wait a minute, Governor.

MR. ROMNEY: My experience is the private sector typically is able to provide a better product at a lower cost.

MR. LEHRER: Can we — can the two of you agree that the voters have a choice, a clear choice between the two of you —